QUOTE FROM JULIE PEZZINO: We are increasingly becoming a society that doesn't gather so much anymore.

And one of the things I absolutely love about this institution, and I know it's true, true of Children's Museums and theaters all over the country is this is a place where people often put down their phones and they engage and interact.

BRIAN MAUGHAN: This is BUILT, the podcast where you meet creative leaders in the commercial real estate industry and hear how they do what they do.

I’m your host Brian Maughan, Chief Innovation and Marketing Officer with Fidelity National Financial. In our fifth season of BUILT, we’re taking a closer look at the places we gather. From museums, to theaters to stadiums, we’re interested in the spaces that bring us together, and the people who work in them. 

BRIAN: In this episode, we’re talking to Julie Pezzino. She's the Executive Director of the Children's Museum and Theatre of Maine, which is a 100-year-old organization, now in a new building in a new mixed-use development at Thompson’s Point in Portland, Maine.

Julie: I've been in this role for about four and a half years. So, I started just about eight months before the pandemic, which was super fun. And then moved into COVID times and then was able to be a part of building this, this beautiful new building.

BRIAN: Julie came aboard the Children's Museum and Theatre of Maine, also known as CMTM, in 2019. But it wasn't the job that drew her in initially. 

Julie: I'm from the Hudson Valley outside of New York City, and moved here about six years ago. Not for this job, but really honestly for the quality of life that Maine brings, I have a young family, and Maine just seemed like a great place to raise kids.

BRIAN: When Julie was growing up in the Hudson Valley, there weren't many children's museums available to visit nearby.

Julie: We spent a lot of time outside. We honestly spent a lot of time sort of entertaining ourselves. And we certainly didn't have access to Institutions like this at least, not in close driving distance, right? We would have to go to, like, New York City in order to experience a museum that was designed specifically for children. 

BRIAN: Julie's professional background is in nonprofit management, which lends itself well to her work now as the Executive Director of a non-profit museum & theatre, but her previous role in Pittsburgh planted some seeds of inspiration for her future work in Maine. 

Julie: I ran an urban food and agriculture organization. We had a robust school garden program. So, I had some experience around developing lessons and thinking about interactive play for children and what lessons, like, gardening can bring to, you know, a kid's overall learning experience.

BRIAN: The Children's Museum & Theatre of Maine has a very long, rich history. The children's theatre was founded in 1924 by the Junior League of Portland, a women-led volunteer organization, making it the oldest children's theatre in the country. Fast forward about 50 years later to 1976 and.... 

Julie: The Children's Museum of Maine is founded also by the Junior League. So that's sort of a neat part of our history that we have this group of volunteers essentially that are responsible for the founding of both organizations. Then, both entities continue on their own for a while until 2008, and that is when the Children's Museum of Maine and the Children's Theater of Maine merged, and they became the Children's Museum and Theater of Maine.

BRIAN: And so in 2008, the oldest children's theatre in the nation merged with the newer children's museum to combine their shared mission: 

Julie: What's instrumental for both a children's theater and a children's museum as far as gathering is concerned is that it creates an opportunity for parents and caregivers to come together and experience the joy of a robust learning experience and a entertainment opportunity for their children where they know that not only are they having fun, but they are, they're getting something really educational and productive out of it. So whether that is enjoying a theater production and watching actors on stage or whether it's playing in an exhibit, there is extreme value in that for parents and caregivers. 

BRIAN: And combining the two organizations brought more families in, which in turn has allowed children the opportunity to explore their interests in ways they may not in school.

Julie: For kids, we hear time and again that these are formative experiences for them. I'm not, I'm not trying to pull one over on you when I say that we have several times had people come to us and say, I wanted to go into safety and helping people and firefighting because I have this formative memory of playing on the firetruck at the Children's Museum and Theater of Maine.

These things do happen. We certainly have actors who were child actors with us as kids who are now in Broadway productions and involved in the arts more significantly. So. I think this opportunity for communal gathering around experiential education is one of the reasons why both the Children's Theater and the Children's Museum have been so successful.

BRIAN: Once the two organizations merged, the theatre found a permanent home in the historic building that had been occupied by the museum since 1993. Located in the heart of downtown Portland at 142 Free Street, it was an ideal spot for both organizations to be frequented by visitors.

BRIAN: 142 Free Street is a beautiful, greek-revival-esque building with large white pillars that greet you from the outside. It had been occupied by the Chamber of Commerce for the city of Portland for decades prior to the children's museum moving in. 

Julie: When we took the building over, you can imagine as you walk in, it was really sort of set up to be to some extent a gathering place, but also to some extent to house And you know, be commercial in a very different way than we are commercial. So, in the ‘90s, I think they certainly had a huge challenge, right? Of figuring out how to turn the inside of this building into a place where children and families could come and play. And so it was essentially three stories, about 18,000 square feet. 

So you'd walk in and if you went up a couple stairs, you'd get to sort of a neighborhood focused area that had a little market. It had a lobster boat, a health center. So some things that were very Maine-themed. We also had a fairly sizable indoor climbing structure on that first floor. And then in the back, there was a fire truck, which was very beloved.

It also was not really fit for adults. So we had a lot of head bumps, adult head bumps, trying to get up to the top of it. 

If you went up to the second floor, There was a space for a rotating exhibit, so we would have many different types of exhibits in that particular space.

And then going back down to the front entrance, if you went down the stairs, that's where the quote unquote theater was.

And that was also a rotating exhibit area. But what we would do is if we had a production, we would essentially literally bring out folding chairs and benches and set that up for the production and then, and then put them away when we were done and turn it back into an exhibit.

Brian IVU: So what brought about this idea of, Hey, let's move the children's theater and museum. Let's look for someplace different. Can you share with us kind of those conversations?

Julie: There's a lot of nostalgia for 142 Free Street, but it certainly had several challenges. One being that it was just a very old building, and when we looked at the costs associated with trying to upgrade the building to have it function at the level that we needed it to, it was going to be very costly.

It also –18,000 square feet, perfectly fine size. But we were looking to close to double our exhibit space. And when we looked at how we could expand outside of the footprint, we just didn't really feel like we could functionally do that 

So my understanding is that the board and staff leadership at the time looked at about 18 different locations in thinking about what a new home could be. And. We realized that if we truly had a blank slate, if we could start from scratch and build a museum and theater exactly as we would want it to look, that that would be the best investment of our time and resources. 

BRIAN: So they began looking for a piece of land on which they could build their new home and in 2017, they made a purchase at Thompson's Point in Portland, located on the northern banks of the Fore River. 

Julie: So Thompson's point, similarly from a historic perspective, has a pretty rich history. It's a former rail yard, so it still houses several very beautiful old industrial brick railway buildings that back in the early 1900s were extremely, extremely active. But it ended up being abandoned for quite some time, until it was purchased by developers for Front Partners who were our partners in this project.

We bought the land from them and they really have turned it into an entertainment destination for the greater Portland region. So we are certainly an anchor to that, but there was activity happening before that down on the point. 

BRIAN: Thompson's Point, once a hub for rail cars and Portland's busy shipyard in the early 20th century suffered as a result of the decline of rail and shipping and by the 1940s, the area had been relegated to industrial manufacturing and storage. Today, Thompson's Point has seen a revitalization of over 2 million square feet of land and has become home to a concert venue, breweries, restaurants, and artists, and of course the new and improved Children's Museum and Theatre of Maine. 

Julie: And one just interesting thing to note is we're actually the only other private landowner on Thompson's Point. Everything else is managed by the development company. And I would describe it sort of as a peninsula. It's right on the water, so you're looking out at the Fore River, which is quite beautiful, and you can see the Jetport from a part of our building, and you can also see the train tracks, and you…can hear both!

Julie & Brian IVU: Ha ha ha [laughter]

BRIAN: With the land secured, the team at CMTM launched into the next phase of their operation: design and fundraising. The project would end up costing about 15 million dollars to complete, but in order to begin a fundraising campaign, they needed design renderings to show potential investors and donors. 

Julie: So once the land was purchased, we really started in earnest to work with our architects, which is Bruner / Cott out of Boston and our exhibit design partner, which was Hands On Studio out of Florida to to start concepting what this building would look like both inside and out and then determine exactly how much it was going to cost.

BRIAN: In the design process, Julie and the design team wanted to take into consideration the historic peninsula and former rail yard that they'd purchased their land on, while creating something new and welcoming. What they came up with was a modern, silver, rectangular building, adorned with multicolored shingles - reds, blues, yellows -- and visible from the highway, with the inside of the building incorporating elements of the land's industrial past. And with the design renderings complete and something to show investors, they embarked on the next phase of their development: the fundraising campaign.

Julie: We needed to raise every dollar to build the building. And so we started talking with, with donors big and small and everywhere from corporations to foundations to individuals. We had support from our city government and actually even from the federal government. It truly took a village to build the building and we received support from really every corner of the philanthropic world.

Brian IVU:  Just to give us an idea, you were in 18,000 square feet of this Free Street building that maybe wasn't quite conducive and put the theater kids in the basement. So, give us an idea, what does it look like now? 

Julie: Yes. So it's 30,000 square feet now. 

So we're on three floors. And now when you walk into our brand new building, you walk into this beautiful, light filled atrium. It has a massive climbing structure that you see immediately when you walk in.

And then the next thing you see right in front of you as you walk in the door is the entrance to our theater. So our theater is now very prominent on the first floor. It takes up probably two thirds of the first floor, including our green room and shop, of which we really didn't have either of those at the old space. And then two additional floors of exhibit space above that.

BRIAN: The theatre and exhibit space isn't the only thing that increased at their new location:

Julie: Our outdoor space was very small at Free Street. It was probably a fifth of the size of what we have now. And I think what we see in terms of gathering, especially post covid for children and families is parents and caregivers are really willing to send their children out in any kind of weather now.

Like, it is a 365 day opportunity to be outside here now, even in Maine. So really, 30,000 square feet is the building size, but then it's another 10,000 square feet of outdoor play space.

Brian IVU: Well, okay. So, give me an idea of what were some of the things that you envisioned going into this new space because you knew you could build for it?

Julie: So one of the things we did early on that I think was really smart is from a design perspective, we both worked with our local talent on staff as well as these national experts in constructing exhibits or designing and constructing exhibits for children's museums. So Chris Sullivan Creative Consulting was our primary partner on the ground here in Maine, and he worked with Hands On to really think about the design of these exhibits from at the quality of like a high end national firm.

But with the real Maine design and focus and connection. And another thing we did early on is we surveyed our constituents, right? Prior to moving here to Thompson's Point, at Free Street, we averaged about 100,000 visitors a year through our doors.

In this past year, we brought in 220,000 people. And so what you see in the exhibits here at the new facility is sort of a nice blend of that old and new.

Julie: We tried to give a nod to the things that people wanted to see. So for example, the fire truck is back!

Brian IVU: That was going to be one of my questions. I wanted to know if it didn't make it.

Julie: It made it, however, it's brand new and now an adult does not hit their head when they climb up the stairs, right? [laughter]

Brian IVU: Oh, wow. 

Julie: And so I, I just say that because we have this built in opportunity to, to survey our, our clientele. What, what are you looking for in this, this opportunity to, to gather with children and families? And we got a lot of really great responses.

BRIAN: And the number one piece of feedback they got? 

Julie: That there was no aquarium in southern Maine. No opportunity to sort of use that type of an exhibit to teach kids about Maine wildlife and the oceans and lakes and rivers of Maine that are so, so critical to this state for all sorts of reasons.

And that was a major lift for us. But we did make the call to design an aquarium. 

And we have now five freshwater tanks. Two saltwater tanks. Dozens and dozens of both saltwater and freshwater native Maine species. That's the kind of thing that, unless you're building from scratch, you could never just drop that into a building.

Brian IVU: I would imagine you have a lot of visitors from across the country. I think you've had visitors from all 50 states and tens and maybe close to 50 different countries. But the community is kind of more frequent, right? I mean, it's like a, it's a basic tenant of the Portland area.

Julie: That's right, so we've had visitors from all 50 states. Last year, we had visitors from 19 countries. However, we also have had visitors from all 16 counties in Maine, and of that 220,000 people, 77% of our visitors are still Maine residents. So we do still see the majority of our visitation coming from right here in this state.

Maine is a tourist state no matter what. Right? And certainly we're seasonal in nature, although increasingly not so. I think you see more and more tourists coming all the time at different seasons, but we absolutely rely on and focus a lot of our efforts from an educational perspective around what is most important to the population of Maine.

BRIAN: Another important component that CMTM felt was essential to expand upon in their new space is creating a sense of belonging. 

Julie: So whether that is a feeling of perhaps they don't have the financial resources to pay for a ticket to get through the doors, whether they might have a physical or cognitive disability that would, would make them feel uncomfortable coming here whether geographically they feel like they live too far away in Maine to, to get here reasonably.

We've worked very hard to ensure that truly everyone feels that they belong at the Children's Museum and Theatre of Maine and we have now gotten to the point that over 20% of our visitation accesses our space through some sort of access initiative. So whether that's through Museums for All, which allows for anyone who is receiving benefits from, say WIC or SNAP programs, you get in for a dollar a person for your entire party.

Whether those are events like our Play Your Way events, which are designed specifically for kids and families who might otherwise not feel comfortable coming to the museum if it's super, super busy or loud. So we see a lot of kids who are on the autism spectrum coming through our doors for those special events.

We might see someone with a physical disability, like being in a wheelchair, and they're worried that there's just going to be too many people in the facility to move around comfortably. We've given a lot of time and effort to ensuring that that belonging work is strong, and it continues.

BRIAN: Belonging also applies to how they built areas of the museum for caregivers, like with their Nursing Nook, a quiet space for moms and infants to get away. It has comfortable chairs, toys for bigger siblings, a sink, and a diaper changing area. 

I wanted to know what Julie had learned throughout the process and why she felt it was important to continue this type of work.

Julie: I guess I'll say I had never been a part of any type of construction project before leading up to being at the Children's Museum and Theater of Maine. It wasn't a part of my previous roles and responsibilities, or it just never even came to be anywhere I had been prior.

So it has been an incredible learning opportunity for me. I will say, I've never been a part of something that has involved so many multi faceted different types of players and people who are so committed and passionate about seeing something come to fruition than this redevelopment project.

And just the positive reinforcement, the belief in our mission, the understanding that in order to thrive, we would need a new home, a bigger home, a home that better suited us. I've never seen a community come together like this before. And that's everything from our construction partners, to our funders, to our members, to our local government, to the federal government even getting involved.

AUDIO FROM CMTM RIBBON CUTTING CEREMONY: 

JULIE PEZZINO: “Even though this amazing building is an incredible accomplishment, it's really about how the museum and theater is a place of gathering, a place where Mainers and visitors come together, a safe place for experiential learning, for discovery and for creating community.  On behalf of the incredibly dedicated staff that makes this building hum,  I want you to know that you all are our family.  So let's keep working together to make Maine an extraordinary place to be a child. Thank you.”

Speaker 2: Thank you Julie from the bottom of our hearts. It is now time to cut the Ribbon!

The Children's Museum and Theatre of Maine officially opened its doors to the public in 2021, overcoming the hurdle of fundraising and developing a building during the height of the pandemic. 

It really is a humbling experience to go through such a significant redevelopment project and then certainly to then add Covid in the mix and then kind of to come out on the other side of that and be able the to open our doors to hundreds of thousands of people who really need this space.

They need it for learning. They need it for their social and emotional health. And kids need it for play, right? I mean, I'll never forget standing in front of the building and cutting that ribbon and watching kids run inside. It has been a defining moment of my career. It might be the defining moment of my career.

I don't know that I'll do anything more fun.

Brian IVU: I love that. I feel very, very fortunate to talk to a wide spectrum, especially in this season. We just released an episode where we spent a significant amount of time at the Mercedes Benz Stadium in Atlanta, Georgia. It's a 1.5 billion dollar building that was created from the ground up.

But it's so interesting to me to hear you talk about this environment, this space with the same zeal and fervor and passion as the folks at Mercedes Benz talk about the Mercedes Benz Stadium, right? That what it's done to the community, the outdoor garden, the benefit to the surrounding local businesses.

I mean, I don't know that it matters if it's 1.5 billion or 15 million, it matters that it becomes part of the community ethos to gather and to, and to be together, part of the fabric of this. 

It matters that there's a place to go. It matters that there's things to do. It matters that people get passion behind it. And so I applaud you. I'm so glad that you got to be a part of it. I can feel it. And that's fun for me. That crackle that you have.

Julie: Well, I, I love what you just said, and I think you're absolutely right, you know? And I think, like, in the end, as humans, right, as professionals, like, we all want to be doing something that matters, and that is helpful to other people. And it's been interesting for me, having never been a part of a redevelopment process before, just quite how, that final product, just how emotional and kind of, significant it can feel. It's very different than designing a program or you know, so many other things that we do in our day to day life that the physicality of it is– it’s significant in a way that I didn't expect.

Brian IVU: Yeah. It sounds like it's more than the 15 million that it took to build this spot. It is more valuable than that and more than we could ever imagine. I can't wait to see it. I've been to Portland.

Julie: Oh!

Brian IVU: I have! I've stood there on the shore. I've been there with my children and my family and actually, I cannot wait to come back.

I have a daughter that lives in Boston, so I might have to take the Amtrak up. And then, and then you'll hear me

Julie: I'll hear you! [laughter] Yeah, you can make sure they, like, really pump that horn really loud.

Brian IVU: Well, this has been a fantastic conversation. I really appreciate it. Thank you so much for what you're doing and for taking the time. And what a great vision and such a good use of space.

Julie: Thank you.

Brian IVU: I love it.

Julie: Thank you so much, and thanks for having me, it's really an honor, and I, I love what you all are doing, and feel, feel really lucky to be a part of it.

Brian IVU: It's our pleasure. It's our pleasure. 

BRIAN: Thanks for tuning into Season Five of Built! We have more great stories coming up…with our next one in two weeks. 

BRIAN: And if you missed the first four seasons, go listen! You can find all Built episodes wherever you get your podcasts. If you like the show, please give us a rating or review on whichever podcast platform you use. It helps new listeners find us.

Built is a co-production of Fidelity National Financial and PRX Productions. From FNF, our project is run by Annie Bardelas. This episode of Built was produced by Morgan Flannery. Our Senior Producer is Genevieve Sponsler and associate producer is Emmanuel Desarme. Audio mastering by Rebecca Seidel. 

The Executive Producer of PRX Productions is Jocelyn Gonzales. 

BRIAN: This episode’s clips were courtesy of the Children’s Museum and Theatre of Maine. The music is from APM Music.

I’m Brian Maughan. 

And remember, every story is unique, every property is individual, but we’re all part of this BUILT world.